Відео

Seems like a fast Fourier Transform that snaps amplitudes to their nearest note frequency. Pretty neat!

This taught me a lot about overtones lmao

Haven't seen something like this before. Can this be used to turn a normal piano into a MIDI input device?

cool! 🤭🤭🤭🤭

I think it's a mistake to eliminate the moving indicator (red line in Pianoscope) to get a single reading. I just spent a few hours with Pianoscope to tune my piano. The moving line guides how much adjustment is needed to get close. I found the process of piano tuning is an exercise in getting close. The "Freeze" function of Pianoscope gives the same info as your device and is adjustable through its parameters. 0.1 cents accuracy is not necessary since the people who judge professional tuners' performance accept 0.9 cents as being acceptable (which, had I known this earlier, would have taken hours off my work...piano tuning is a difficult job for people who are nitpickers for pecision.)

I recently tuned a grand piano with PianoSens at a church and about halfway through I was told that about 40 violinists needed to use the room to warmup before a recital. I told them, “no problem,” I put on some headphones, and was able to continue to tune normally while the room was filled with the cacophony of 40 students simultaneously playing 😄

Hi, I wish I could hear some samples of tempered fifths, fourths, sixths or thirds… Maybe a double-octave or a 19th (in middle-section)… I tune by ear a low octave with a 19th and/or double-octave. Infact: I tune with verituner, but not in the lower section. Here: I only compare with overtones, double-octave and 19th. To find the best compromise between thes three components makes my clients happy; they are amazed.

Those are top grade mics placed in good positions. Imagine how much wilder the deviations would be where ETD mics end up getting positioned for a tuning- which is to say for good line-of-sight between the tuner and the screen, not good audio. Not to mention whatever weird characteristics cheap built-in device mics have.

Great work! My whole life I have tuned on the sustain tail, whether by ear or ETD, because that was really the only way we could tune. I look forward to using a new method snap-shotting the pitch a fraction of a second in as suggested by your work and hearing the aesthetic result as music is played. The idea of tuning to a better standard than has ever been possible before in history is very exciting.

With this device would you tune A0 to 27.5 htz? how does this compensate for the idea of stretching octaves at the upper and lower ends of the keyboard

Hi Steven, saw your pianoworld post. Very interesting comparison. There is a technique called the "phase vocoder" that builds on the STFT which can produce the kind of frequency and amplitude analysis you're talking about here. I first encountered it many ears ago in the book "Digital Audio Signal Processing: An Anthology" by John Strawn, but I'm sure there are other explainers online now.

Interesting

You have to watch this several times. It’s the best explanation of why we need to tune unisons as perfectly as possible- how it affects the tone. The second example in the video has a sound that would make me think the string wasn’t seated properly or the hammer needs to be filed. But that’s not it - it’s the response of the partials behaving from the result of a less than perfect unison. The kind of unison you would get when tuning by ear.

This is outstanding work. The most comprehensive objectively measured description of what is happening with pitch following the note strike that has ever been published/reported I believe.

What tuning curve do you use in Pianoscope?

Just curious why you set all octaves at 200ms instead of using he default setting for freeze that ranges from 500 -300?

Perhaps the sensor is insensitive to the movements of the string in the plane of the soundboard, and therefore it does not detect the beats arising from the vertical and horizontal modes of the string vibration. If the beats do occur between the soundboard's natural frequency, then 3bps must be present on all 3 strings of the choir

The first partial in the vibrations of the string is present and lasts for a very long time. But it is poorly radiated by the soundboard due to the high impedance of the soundboard and due to the acoustic short circuit (in far acoustic field). Human ear is significantly less sensitive to low frequencies. Therefore, the fundamental tone goes below the hearing threshold and is masked by overtones. Also, the fundamental tones in the strings of the lower octave do not participate in interval beating(octaves,5ths, etc) and therefore fundamental tones of A0...G#1 are not important for tuning

Subtitles: tap-tap-tap-tap-tap-tap

Lovely. Would've liked to hear what it sounded like both before and after. Can you make another video?

Thanks!

It's really too bad there are less than a handful of truly knowledgeable piano techs in the entire country. Fortunately there are a few. You absolutely are one of them.

Just a suggestion: don't bother with trying to support Android. At my last gig, we were making a specialized camera that supported both iOS and Android, and Android sunk easily 3x the engineering effort for about 1/4 of the revenue.

As good as the best concert quality tunings I have ever heard. Oh, yeah, great playing too.

Amazing how clear each note is. Each unison (all 3 strings played together) is beatless, in perfect tune. Nice!

The clarity of this tuning is just amazing. I've been tuning 36 years, and I could not do this, by ear or otherwise. It doesn't hurt that the piano is amazing, but the clean sound of the Fazioli makes it hard to hide any imperfection in the tuning.

Which tuning app did you use?

The tuning sounds amazing. I don't think I have ever heard better. And of course it's a fabulous piano as well. And played well. What a combination!

It's the latest Verituner for Android, on Android 12, on a 2023 Moto G Play using a cable that came bundled with the PianoSens package.

TUNIC only:pure try this

Interesting Experiment! Can you specify the settings a bit more regarding: - used microphones and orientation(especially important IMO is off-axis-performance/ coloring - Schoeps has demonstrated this quite nicely) - distance (maybe it would be better to measure at various listener positions several meters away) - which "very sophisticated sprectal resolution techniques" were used in Matlab - at which point of the played note did you capture the soundfile (attack included? length?)

Are you marketing this somewhere?

My iPhone only has a port for charging I don’t see one for USB. How would that work?

Who tunes with a Reattack rate that fast? Most beginning tuners make the mistake of reattack rates much too slow.

Intriguing.

This is important information for those of us who use ETD's to professionally tune pianos. I was not aware that the microphone in my iPhone was introducing errors into the calculation of my ETD. It's not intuitive, because when we make a recording, it sounds good. So then, what could be wrong with using a microphone in the phone, or any external mic? It turns out, there IS a problem. That's because the microphone picks up all kinds of other sounds that are not relevant to tuning a piano, and there are patterns of wave interferences that are invisible to us that the mic responds to. That affects the relative strengths of the overtones in the sound envelope sampled through the mic. The ETD then interpolates those overtones and calculates the frequency target. But if the overtones are mixed in with these acoustic anomalies, the result is that the target frequency is off. When using the Pianosens, all of the impertinent sound vibrations are eliminated, and only the vibration of the string is used for calculation. The result is much more accurate, which means your tunings become better when using your ETD. This mic discrepancy is the reason that the tuner-technician must check the final result to verify if the tuning is as accurate as we expect from our ETD's. Thanks, Steve.

hi What software is used for measurement in the video?

This is fascinating. As a guitar player, I get the tuning peculiarities factoring the acoustical nature of tuning. As a recording engineer I wonder how your device would “translate” in a recording. Maybe I’ve missed something along the way…

Are you actually selling these devices? Planning to? I'm interested but need to know how to accomplish buying one.

Paul, Yes, I suspect that is the case. Considering the fact that a soundboard panel (not installed in the case) typically will vibrate actively at no lower than about 49hz (roughly an octave above A0), and when installed in the piano case that base frequency (unloaded) jumps up to nearly 60hz generally speaking. So except in the case of an extremely large instrument, the ability to reproduce those low fundamentals should be quite impossible. Or if able to, quite inaudible to our ears or microphones. Therefore our brain "fills in" the missing stuff and we "hear" those low frequencies. Even though (at this time) I am a dedicated analog/aural tuner, I have long suspected that acoustic anomalies including absence of various partials in certain notes has an adverse effect on my ability to tune some notes accurately. My proof of this is when I can't hear the 6:3 octave partials clearly (down low) and I try to "ghost" it and it's not there. One note above it's fine, but on this note it's gone. I have to use another interval or "fake it" to the best of my ability. I'm looking forward to trying this thing out. When Steve told me it has a headphone jack that sealed the deal for me. I see this as an innovation with numerous potentials. Peter Grey Piano Doctor

This also proves that there IS a fundamental of the note, not that it is absent. This is a misconception that there is no fundamental in the lower bass notes. The piano may not be able to respond to the string movement due to the design, and thus not create the fundamental frequency into sound.

Hi want to buy but your website is not working. How can i contact you?

Hi! Want to buy you website dosent work, can I contact you someway?

Will it work with Verituner?

How is Pianosens different from the Freeze feature that is built into Pianoscope which (also?) shows a frozen moment in time after the strike of a hammer. It also has an indicator that reflects the rest of the sound coming from the string, which drops in pitch as time moves forward. Is Pianosens just capturing a similar (frozen) moment in time or is it doing something other? Thanks.

This would be a good tool for tuning period specific tuning systems for classical music