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Also I wonder if i can pay you to have a conversation... I do thinking about to start working on something like this but i dont know how deep is it. my thinking is decode CAN message from ECU i can trigger all the error and then try to decode it with oscilloscope with my custom BMS (84s BMS controlling additional relay) capture the message and then play it back to car main CAN line when needed.....

I guess even if i can find the OEM Lithium BMS it would be limited. Let me know if there is any way i can help on your customer BMS for Prius. I really want something that works besides Jack or other half ass solution.

Do you have a facebook account or any other way i can share image conversation with you? I think with your help I may close to a solution. I'm not here to make money. I have a lot of other car modules I'm trying to wire up as well (ADAS modules) for simi self driving.. I dont know how hard is it to get start on decoding the CAN Message from different Toyota ECU and how build local test environment. All I can find from Toyota development platform is their radio entertainment system which is not helpful at all...

your videos has been super educational i wish i watch your video before spending the 20k learning from trial and errors. I did not go as crazy as Jack, I install powerful 70s cell level balancer (monitor temp, resistant and voltage). So far i has been lucky no issue during driving. I was consider buying jack nexus battery because it fit the battery case perfectly but i understand now why its trash and not saveable. 1. the soldiering (resistant between cell are not equals) can't withstand vibrations. 2. Quality control on batteries (after market cell has lower quality and not been tested in higher stander) 3. balancing (no cell level balancing system in place) 4. compression, the compression for the battery (plasmatic cell is not enough when compare to OEM) 5. differences in charge and discharge curve (I was assuming the total usable energy is simply by (8ah * 201v normal ) = usable-able power in Lipo4 cell but does not seem its the case.... 6. cooling, compares to OEM the plastic case and design does not seem to provide enough cooling to each modules But the most crazy part is that you showing Jack is actually using cell that Rated for 2-3C.... and was using hot glue to mount that batters. Its seem He is one big liability away from bankruptcy, by point out the fact you are doing his favor saving his ass.....

Hi I did some research on the GEN3 toyota prius plugin I was thinking installing the 2016 OEM lithium pack into the 2013 car and then use the Plugin battery ECU computer to monitor each lithium cell with a 4A balancer. my question is does the (regular Prius gen3 non plugin) CAN BUS System recognize the plugin ecu ? can the ecu be register?

Hi is it possible I can send you few sample battery for testing I currently build hybrid battery myself

I wonder how are you able to reverse engineering the PCU and able to talk to the car system, yes for me this is the most important thing once you can register the error code in the System CAN you can do anything.... one my second battery design i tried to wire up a Prius gen 3 plugin battery ECU to a none plugin system hoping the system will recognize it given it may use similar software. I can hard find documentation on the wiring pin let alone the CAN signal..... one of my thought is to manually enable to error code and then use a binary recorder to capture these can signal and then play it as condition meet.. manually trigger DTC intercept CAN signal capture signal binary into storage mounting after market BMS and program when error happen replay the recorded CAN singal best way to do this is to have a simulation of test environment (how to setup toyota local CAN??) to similar driving condition.

I was trying to DIY that hybrid battery myself after spending 20k i then realize what is wrong. I learn it by tear-down other cars all Lithium iron battery has to has cell level monitoring and some what of balancing, if a wire somehow get lose a bit with even 0.01 om of resisdent it grow overtime and destory a cell..

I have DIY battery myself all the lead soilder cell end up having issue so i switch to mechanical connection to all the battery cells. lead soilder does not end well in vibration....

Have few question really want to ask. when you switch the Honda insight form the stock NiMH battery to the 40A lithium battery what type mpg did you get from that swap? given the battery was not charge. Does switch to bigger battery gives you better MPG given you dont charge the battery. From my experience when switch to a larger cell on prius it mess up the charge and discharge cycle. i will want the answer very much. One of my thinking of having a larger cell is to keep the RPM in a constant, when going up hell engine rpm is running from 2000 to 3000RPM but with a larger battery with constant 1 min of 100A of discharging it should keep the engine at a 2000 when there is a high power demand. there for maybe better MPG

Enerkey 15A Smart Active Balancer 24S Lifepo4 / Lipo/ LTO Battery Equalization With APP i put 15A balancer to balance ALL 70S 8A Lipo4 Cell Easy right ?

I do have a lithium install with after market 84S BMS Install with 5A Balancer for each every cell

I found a way to deal with it without a BMS, I uses Headway 38120 charge 120A discharged 200A rated, with 3 4A battery monitor and balancer so all cell will be monitor by all 3 24s balancer in total of 70S cells

The only thing this is good for is inaccurate prototypes in soft material. And even that is a stretch. I unfornatunately bought my machine years ago before Tear Down videos was popping up online. But I come here also hoping someone with more cnc experience can help me. My Bantam died on me, so I started replacing boards, convenienlty for Bantam the power board, TingG and ESC to rid me of the problem of a constant single beep after turning the machine on. Also, I get no green lights on the TinyG board. All the harness' are connected in the correct order. Now they want me to spend another 200.00 on a shipping box and return shipping because they're telling me a tech will have to go over it. Does anyone have an idea what would be causing these beeps instead of the usual Start Up Chime? Limit switichs? Bad Stepper?

From experience, worst money spent. it's garbage, even for light duty milling

How is your own battery support unit doing?

Is it just me or would it make more sense to just use a voltage divider setup to feed all 14 wires(effectively dummying out the original pack BSU wires), and then use a separate BMS(or multiple) that actually look at each cell; have the output from that BMS ground out one of the 14 BSU wires(which would show a big fault) if there ever was an issue? This way you would have the safety covered(single cell issue -> triggers BMS to trip -> triggers BSU -> CEL and hybrid pack disabled. The only thing you wouldn't get is knowledge of *which* cell tripped it, but it wouldn't really matter as you would need to open the pack and test it anyway.

I just dont fully understand why there needs to be lithium or salt batteries, if they dont use the full capacity and if the computer have limitations that make all the advancements not really worth it? Why not just get similar battery chemistry, if the idea is to offer an alternative to OEM, and hard or expensive to get OEM, if the original lasts so damn long already? All the concerns about safety and the like, associated with yhe jump from NiMH to a new tech, without adequate skills to do so. Just a 3rd market affordable option alone would be good business no? I dont get it.

i don find your second part, i hope you publish more reviws like this are very good

Bantam is a dirty company. I've had 3 of their machines. They worked great for about 8 months. One of the USB connections which had little to close to no solder came loose. They said it was not covered under warranty and wanted to charge me $1k for a Tiny G 9 board. In addition to that, 1 month after we had bought our 3rd machine they released the 4th axis, again they said the upgraded board would be $1k, WTF? The board already supports 6 Axis. The company could have been a contender, but instead some nit wit wanted to make a pen plotter, that was a waste of capital. They recently raised their price for a set of aluminum soft jaws from 16.00 to 81.00 a pair! Soon there will be a "For Lease" sign on their building. Thanks for taking the time to do the tear down and give an honest in depth review of these trash bins.

Yikes! Thank god I found this video before ordering 100 sodium cells off AliB for my gen 0 Prius. Quite a few of the 25 yo original NiMh battery sticks would likely out perform these cells 😮 I won't even bother testing the 5 sample cells i ordered… they'll now be installed in some solar garden lights 😂 Thanks so much for doing the tests and posting the video 👍

Have you done a review on NexPower V3 GT sodium-ion blades? I’m thinking about buying them.

how many power switches they have on the output inverter stage ? do you know ?

Hello, I have a few questions, where can I contact you?

somebody is offering nearly new prius upgrade cells they took out of their wrecked car,,. 14 of these packs, what do you think their useful value is in an ebike price range

I checked on alibaba there are some 10Ah cells declarering 10c and 30c peek current. Offcouse it may be the numbers on paper only. Regarding usable pack capacity if you compare to the stock pack (1300wh) and assume hybrid ecu try to keep it between 40 to 80% SOC you get usable capacy only 520wh so in general if sodium cell could accept higher current you should get more or less the same capacity. Have you tested nimh cell or module on your tester. It would be interesting to see how it performs. The idea of using sodium is not to replace lithium but to replace nimh so actually you shoul compare it with nimh. Ofcourse lithium is way better for energy storage but sodium in my opinion have 2 hudge advantages: it is much safier and cheeper.

Great video, no more questions about "the product" :) Just considering regarding operating capacity of sodium battery pack in general. Do you know how hybrid ecu calculate SOC? I think it is not a simply direct pack voltage measurements. I think it also related to cahrging/discharging current measurements. If it would be related direct to the voltage you can simply fake module voltages to make a look like car is operating with nimh.

Any rough guestimates on various dimensions of that gantry? 😂 just curious good sir

Great breakdown of this cnc mill. I am working on building my own so this was really helpful to see. Would be great to get your walk through of all the machining and parts on the gantry

Hot glue on a battery that's going to heat up? What were they thinking 🤦

I hope you're able to get your hands on production GT V3. Thank you so much for doing this for the Prius community. I thought I was going to get the GT version 3 but I'm definitely having second thoughts now. Any chance you're going to come out with a replacement battery for the Prius?

I was considering buying one of these until i saw this video, now im going to go oem because why would i replace toyota engineering with jank

I have a powerwall 2 that sat for well over a year maybe two years. The battery is completely dead so the battery control module is dead. I am looking to open it and jump it to get it started. I am pretty comfortable on working on exposed high voltage but want to be smart about it. If I just tilt the bottom up is there a bare spot on the 48V bus at the bottom I can put alligator clip on? Even before that question was there by chance 48V coming up to the cooling fan section I could exploit?

Excellent video, thank you for sharing! Would you be able to explain how you discharged the battery before removing the pack from the enclosure?

Hii can you design a battery and sell it you seems like you know your stuff more than jack. i was thinking of buying project lithium product but always new versions feels like everything is a beta product he sells and i dont want to spend alot of money upgrading battery to have to rip open half my car to replace battery every few years

That blade looks like an older model (possibly V1?). The V2+ have more vents on the top as well as some improvements in the bms/wiring (from what I recall reading about). Have you had a chance to look at the newest version? (V2.6) I know the guy (Jack) is currently experimenting with NA batteries now (presumably for their temperature tolerance) I can see from the website (Nexcell/projectlithium) these are SUPPOSED to be 2p5s (for 16v nominal) but only 5 are visible (are they stacked?) They seem to be incredibly cheaply made. Now that I see them apart (thank you) I see why Toyota put METAL plates between the blades to PRESUMABLY draw heat, but now I think it has as much to do with distributing the compression uniformly.

Fantastic!

Where can we go to hear updates on the status of your Prius project? Is there a newsletter or waitlist we can join?

Thanks for sharing your concern. As another comment pointed out, the "V3 GT" seems to be of a different design. What do you think about this one? With people like NexPower guys and constructive analysis like yours, very good products could get on the market. I'm just glad it happens to be designed for the very car I own.

Gen 2 Prius owner here. Thanks for your work. The "signal smoother" is outrageous.

andddd jack took his video of him smashing the battery down ...

So sad he took his rage induced video down before I could watch it. ;(

Jack took his response down. That just goes to show his character. Or lack there-of.

One of the biggest concerns ive had with any battery replacement is the temperature vs allowed C rate curve. Which is different based on chemistry. I monitor battery current, temperature, and maximum allowed charge/discharge rate on my vehicles. From my long term observations of my Toyota/ford hybrids is that the C rate is allowed is maximum at temperature 20-40c. And it derates once you leave that range. As the nimh chemistry is pretty robust, even in the negatives there is still allowed a reasonable c rate which helps warm the battery and get it to the peak performance temperature range. But from what i see, all replacement lithium packs do nothing to inform the car to reduce Regen at low temperature as lithium cannot take the same amount of charge rate at negative temperature as nimh, if any. Ive also seen there to be a upper and lower voltage allowed during operation, so during peak regen i may see 100amps until the pack voltage hits the threshold and then the regen is dialed back to respect the upper voltage limit. So a lower resistance pack should be able to regen for longer due to less voltage rise. I also see near 100amp regen for longer when starting with a lower soc, and SOC charge limits don't kick in till 80percent soc typically. Additionally for Ford vehicles i have observed (2010 and 2007) i believe the battery c rate calculation is done in the BMS and communicated to the powertrain management which respects the limits requested. However on gen3 Toyota, i have seen signs that the power limit calculation and SOC is done in the powertrain computer and the BMS simply reports temperature/voltage/current. This makes things complicated potentially. Im interested in reverse engineering the BMS to powertrain serial communication, to see how if could be adapted to better fit different battery chemistries, pack sizes, voltages, etc. If I can be of help to you, let me know, i would love to help develop an alternative bms.

Waiting for you to turn comments off for this video like you did to the loose wire one. Thats usually because you can’t handle criticism.

What your saying does make since. There are clear corners that where cut to save on costs. While sodium ion is slightly safer of a technology it still has its hazards.

Is there a way to just use the battery with a regular 48v inverter and charge with a mppt controller?

You just read books on lithium batteries, you have no experience in the field and do not even own a Prius to test this on. Your opinions aren't valid. (As per your own admissions on Prius Chat).

Been using the 10Ah cells for about a year now. Decent cells, when used in an application that can benefit from the wide voltage range.

I wonder if they would have blown more violently if you used a higher current for the load?